I visited Cardinal Hlond at 5.0 this evening at 42 Via Marsala the House of the Salesian Fathers. The appointment had been arranged for me by Monsignore Tardini with whom, as well as with Monsignore Montini, I had discussed the whole matter during the preceding twenty-four hours.

The Cardinal is a man of robust health and gives the impression of being equally robust in character. When talking about the sufferings and trials of Poland he never allows himself to be overcome by his emotions. It would be hard to imagine a man more fitted to lead the Polish Catholics through a terrible persecution. Having conveyed to him the good wishes and deep sympathy of the Taoiseach I told him the purpose of my visit. Mr. de Valera was most anxious to help the Polish people and he wished to do whatever Ireland could do to lessen the trials which Catholic Poland had to suffer. The Warsaw Government had sent out certain feelers to ascertain whether diplomatic relations could not be established between them and the Irish Government; and it occurred to Mr. de Valera that an Irish mission to Warsaw might be of some help to the Polish people and might possibly be a factor in preventing a still worse persecution of the Church.

When Mr. de Valera heard that His Eminence was coming to Rome, he immediately instructed me to come and visit him and to ask his advice, in the most complete confidence, as to what was best to do in regard to the matter of recognition, having exclusively in mind the interests of the Catholic Church and people of Poland. At an earlier date, on the instructions of Mr. de Valera, I had spoken to the Holy Father as well as to Monsignori Montini and Tardini on the same issue. They were opposed to recognition at that time and, although I had not again seen the Holy Father, I could understand from Monsignori Montini and Tardini that no change had since taken place in that attitude. The Cardinal answered me without a moment's hesitation. He was extremely grateful for Mr. de Valera's message but it was perfectly clear to him that no step whatever towards recognition should be taken by us at the present time. It was indeed at the present moment an accidental advantage for the Catholic Church and for the people of Poland that the great powers, especially, had missions in Warsaw. They served as a window for the outside world to witness some of the events taking place in his country, and they were also channels through which Poland might communicate with her friends. The Polish people could not, and did not, accept these missions as in any way implying a duty in their regard to recognize a government which had been most cruelly enforced upon them by an outside power and which remained entirely subservient to that power. They accepted the presence of the missions in Warsaw as part of the cruel fortunes of war, but that was all. In such a galère Catholic Ireland had no place. The sending of an Irish representative to Poland would be taken as an abandonment of Poland by one of her few real friends in the world. The intention of the gesture would be misunderstood by the Polish people and the Warsaw Government would make the utmost use of it to enslave the people. The only purpose of the Warsaw Government démarche was to secure strength for itself against the people of Poland. That Government knew that, practically, the entire population was in a state of resistance and that Polish Catholicism was so strong that it would never yield to the forces arrayed against it. The Government were therefore seeking outside support, and to secure recognition by Catholic Ireland would be a coup de ma￿e for them, as it might be a coup mortel for the Polish people.

As for the future, the Cardinal has no illusions. The elections on the 22nd January are likely to be as great a travesty of democracy as the elections which recently took place in Romania. If they are, then God help the Polish people and the Catholic Church. If the elections, by a miracle, should result in a victory for Catholic Poland over Bolshevism, then Ireland's recognition would, of course, be of real value. The Cardinal had no such hope. At present the persecution of the Church was being somewhat soft-pedalled. He himself had not encountered much difficulty in getting out of the country. The Government are confining themselves to killing off the principal followers of the Vice-President¹ who are, of course, Catholics and good Poles; to preventing the publication of Bishops' pastorals; to putting every obstacle in the way of communication with Rome; to arresting priests for 'abuse of the pulpit'; to imposing a universal censorship which catches in its net and mutilates or destroys every Catholic statement or document. In fact, there is what all Poles rightly regard as the calm before the storm - a storm which, unless all prognostications be wrong - will burst with all its fury after the elections. His Eminence is quietly confident that the Polish people and clergy will resist to the bitter end in defending their religion and their national traditions. Nothing can cajole or intimidate them into abandoning their faith for Communism or for the Orthodox creed. In his view the only hope for Poland, as indeed for all Russian occupied Europe, is the withdrawal of the Russian armies within their own borders. Indeed unless this happens there is little or no hope for Christian Civilisation east or west of the Elbe.

I think I should report my own conviction of the truth of the opinion expressed by the Cardinal and the Holy See. Even if Irish representation were to serve a certain good purpose, as it well might, the damaging and discouraging effects of such a step, and not only in Poland, would far outweigh the good it might do. I often think of a possible but most unlikely parallel. Suppose that when the English evacuated Ireland they had left behind them a government of English or Anglo-Irish adventurers and told the world that Ireland was a free country governing herself; and suppose that the Holy See were to send a Nuncio to Dublin in such circumstances, how many of our people would understand the good motives behind such a step? Would they not primarily think of the evil done by the recognition of the false Government? And what an immense confusion of minds and sentiments would follow amongst Irish Catholics?

The Poles are no less strong in their religious and national feelings than we are, and while Ireland's recognition would not be such a terrible blow as abandonment of either country by the Holy See, nevertheless to a people determined to fight to the last a tyrannical externally imposed Government such recognition would be a great trial.

The Cardinal is facing almost certain martyrdom for himself and his priests with most edifying courage. Before leaving he asked me to convey his most heartfelt good wishes to Mr. de Valera for his and for Ireland's happiness.

The Taoiseach can feel absolutely certain that his generous gesture towards Poland has won for him and for Ireland the undying friendship of this very noble prelate. It has also made a deep impression on the Holy See.