On Wednesday the 25th April, 1945 a further Conference was held in the Department of Finance in regard to the question of providing relief supplies for European countries.

Mr. McElligott opening the Conference said that since the last meeting the Departments of Supplies and Agriculture had prepared statements as to the quantity and value of foodstuffs and other commodities which it was estimated could be released for Europe. He mentioned that the total estimated cost would be more than £3,000,000 and that possibly the Government would have to face criticism from persons who held the view that commodities of the kind should not be sent out of the country having regard to our present circumstances.

Mr. Walshe said that in his opinion the Dáil and the public generally would have very little objection to the giving of free gifts to devastated areas, particularly if such gifts were given in kind and not in cash. He pointed out that the amount of money involved would be regarded as rather a small donation compared with the value of help given by such countries as Sweden and Switzerland and that he felt it would be desirable that our contribution should compare favourably with those of other countries. On this point, Mr. Ferguson remarked that in effect the situation was simply that with the exception of horses and cattle, the offer suggested would represent a cut in current consumption of commodities which were already scarce and in some cases rationed here.

Mr. Boland stressed the necessity for making it clear in any public announcement, that the giving of relief on the scale proposed represented a real sacrifice to the people of this country.

In regard to the statement prepared by the Department of Supplies, Mr. Shanagher pointed out that he was not happy in his mind about sending 'Extract of Liver' as part of the relief supplies. He said that the firm who manufacture this item had been regarded as 'suspect' by the Department of Local Government and Public Health, that there was uncertainty as to their technical efficiency and that in the circumstances it would, perhaps, be as well to exclude this item from the list. This was agreed.

Mr. Twomey referred to the fact that the sending of consignments of canned meat would depend on whether there were available supplies of tin and solder and, that it might be necessary for us to arrange with governments applying for canned meat to provide us with containers.

Mr. Ferguson said that he understood that some countries, such as Holland might prefer to pay for what they got instead of accepting it as a free gift. On this point Mr. Hanna raised the question whether countries willing to pay would be allowed to take more than their fair share of the supplies in the pool. In his opinion the real difficulty lay, not in withdrawing these supplies from current consumption in the country or in assembling them for shipment but in their allocation and subsequent distribution. Mr. Shanagher considered it vital to have reliable information as to the relative necessity of any countries who applied to us for a share in any relief which we may provide. Mr. Ferguson said he understood that the Dutch Government were arranging to send some of their nationals, who were resident in Ireland, to Holland, to obtain firsthand information on the situation there and to pass it on to our Department of External Affairs. Mr. Walshe stressed the need for reliable information as to local conditions, and pointed out that in this matter this country would have to line up with any big relief scheme organised by the British and Americans. Mr. Leydon said that he thought the question of allocation would perhaps be settled by deciding to give the horses to France, and the other supplies to Belgium and Holland.

As a suggestion to meet the practical difficulties of distribution Mr. Hanna said that we could possibly avail of the International Red Cross Organisation or UNRRA. On this point Mr. Walshe stated that it would be much more desirable to deal direct with governments rather than with organisations such as the International Red Cross – the Spanish Red Cross had failed us in the matter of distributing relief sent to Spain. He said that apart altogether from the question of proper distribution, this country would get much more credit and much more publicity for our action if we operated through Governments.

Mr. McElligott referred to the fact that the situation could possibly be further complicated by lack of co-ordination between UNRRA and AMGOT.¹

It was agreed that it would seem preferable to deal direct with governments in the matter of distribution.

Mr. Leydon suggested that a general announcement could be made to the effect that these supplies were available, that a reasonable time could be given to the various governments in which to make application to us, and that we could then proceed to allocate the supplies on the basis of needs and transport facilities. Mr. Twomey referred to the difficulty of shipping accommodation, and particularly in regard to the transport of cattle and Mr. Ferguson remarked that it would be up to the governments applying for our supplies to arrange for the provision of shipping accommodation. Mr. Leydon explained the existing arrangements under which the United Nations operate their shipping pool.

Mr. McElligott drew attention to the fact that the giving of the relief mentioned would in practice amount to a diversion of supplies from Great Britain, and that it might be well to bear in mind possible British reactions. Mr. Twomey pointed out that in the matter of cattle the numbers proposed were very small in comparison with the numbers received from us by Great Britain. Mr. Leydon made the point that the British themselves were sending commodities to Europe of which we were badly in need here.

Mr. Walshe raised the question of the possibility of our taking in refugee children here. He said that some four or five hundred Dutch Catholic children between the ages of five – twelve are at present boarded out in England, mainly in Protestant homes and that the Dutch Catholics are anxious to have these children placed in Catholic homes. He also mentioned the possibility of a proposal to take in five hundred Jewish children at present in America. Mr. McElligott enquired whether the taking in of refugee children in the numbers mentioned would have any material effect on our own supply position, and Mr. Twomey said that as far as agricultural supplies are concerned they would make no material difference. Mr. Leydon asked whether families receiving such children would be paid and by whom. Mr. Walshe said that the British committee looking after this problem in England had received more voluntary offers to take such children than there were children available, that he believed that generally the question of payment would not arise – arrangements of course, would have to be made to enable these children to be periodically inspected and attended by their own clergy. In the matter of accommodating and looking after these children it was probable that the Red Cross would assist and, Mr. McElligott said that he took it that if the question of these children coming to Ireland arises there would be no discrimination on a religious basis.

Mr. Walshe also mentioned that he expected within a short time two French priests from England, who were at present in London and awaiting visas – they are attached to an organisation in Paris apparently operating under the Relief Bureau of the Holy See and the object of their coming to Ireland is, it is understood, to collect money to rebuild French churches. He pointed out that the situation is rather delicate and complicated, but that if these priests came here with proper authority from the Holy See, the Irish Bishops would have to receive them. Mr. Leydon remarked that any money collected in Ireland for relief in Europe would raise the question of foreign exchange.

The following views emerged from the discussion:-

Mr. McElligott closing the discussion said that a Memorandum would be prepared in the Department of Finance on the basis of the statements furnished by the Departments of Agriculture and Supplies and the proceedings at the Conference. The Memorandum would be ready for consideration by the government for Friday's meeting. It would be circulated to members of the Conference as soon as possible.